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Author Topic: Red Cap Oranda - please advise  (Read 683 times)
griffon81
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Red Cap Oranda - please advise
« on: June 18, 2012, 06:18:42 PM »

I have kept goldfish for several years now and today came accross something worrying.
My 2 year old Oranda became sick yesterday. Very lethargic, not eating, hardly breathing. I tested the water, all chemical levels were fine and his tankmate ( a fantale) showing no signs of distress whatsoever. Unfortunatly his condition worsened and he passed away today. I noticed pon removing him from the tank that his wen on his head looked "wrong" as if some of the small bubble like areas it is made from had deflated for want of a better word. No other signs of illness / injury. Has anyone come accross this before? He was the first Oranda I have ever owned that developed a wen so this is a new one for me. I would really apreciate any help / info that anyone can provide as I am quite distressed by this as my fish normally live for longer than two years! Did I do something wrong? Was there some kind of specialist requirement of a Red Cap oranda?
Again many thanks in advance to anyone who can shed some light on this for me.
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griffon81
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Re: Red Cap Oranda - please advise
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2012, 06:52:08 PM »

Hi, Sorry, just read the do's and don'ts and missed a few bits of info.
The tank is 63 litres.
There were two inhabitants Diplo - the Red Cap who died and Don the fantail who is thankfully still with me. Diplo was 3 inches or so long and Don is about 3 1?2 inches long.
I use a fluval 3 filter system.
Water changes every week of 15 - 20% and a monthly change of 50%.
I use a standard King Britiish water dechlorinator with every change.
I test the water about every two weeks or so and the reading are always well within breed toleraces.
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Nossie
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Re: Red Cap Oranda - please advise
« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2012, 06:55:55 PM »

That is a giant don't right there. Your tank isn't big enough even for one goldfish, of course the "extra" one would die, soon the fantail might get sick too if you won't upgrade. I would never put a goldfish in a tank smaller than 150 liters because these fish grow really large and can live up to 20+ years if taken care of properly Smiley

Buy a bigger tank, and while you wait for that, change out 50% of the water once or twice a week.
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Mindemae
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Re: Red Cap Oranda - please advise
« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2012, 06:57:05 PM »

Sounds like he may have had some sort of infection going on in his wen.  They can become infected and even get a fungus.
What size tank do you have these guys in?
When you say water conditions were fine exactly what were the results of each test and which tests did you do?
Orandas need to be kept in pristine water condtions or unfortunately they can get an infected wen.
They can live up to 30 years if cared for properly.
 I'm sorry you lost your fish. Cry  2 years is young.  Most goldfish with wens don't get their full wen until they are 3-4 years of age.
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griffon81
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Re: Red Cap Oranda - please advise
« Reply #4 on: June 18, 2012, 07:15:27 PM »

Ok, So will get a bigger tank in the next day or so. ( My bad doesn't really cover it... Angry)
The Ph was 7.2 Nitrate was 200 Can't remember what the Nitrite reading was. But would have taken action if it came back as a problem.
Think he was a little older than two when I bought him as a replacemnt for my 6yr old black moor who died as Don was a larger fish and didn't want him to get picked on. (Not sure if goldfish pick on each other but didn't want to take the chance as have had tropical who have bullied each other before.)
I didn't see any signes of infection. No redness to the gills, white fluffy patches, rotted fins, spots etc. Nothing. I've got 10years experiance of keeping cold water and tropical fish and this really stumped me. Haven't been able to find anything on the net similar.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2012, 07:22:44 PM by griffon81 » Logged
Mindemae
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Re: Red Cap Oranda - please advise
« Reply #5 on: June 18, 2012, 07:20:58 PM »

Your nitrite and ammonia should always read zero, nitrates should be no more than 40 ppm., 20 ppm is even better! Wink
Glad to hear you will get a bigger tank.
You know there is a difference in surviving and thriving.  You will see such a difference in your fish if they do not live in crowded condtions!  They will be gloriously beautiful and you will enjoy them so much more. Smiley
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griffon81
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Re: Red Cap Oranda - please advise
« Reply #6 on: June 18, 2012, 07:28:30 PM »

Never thought the tank was too small (st*pid mistake really) Have had the same size tank for 8 years with two ocupants. Originally Don and a black moor (Patrick) who passed two and a half years ago then with Diplo the red cap. Never really had any hassle with my cold water fish as oposed to the tropical I have. (Guppies.... too many guppies to name....just when I think I've got all the males out in time they prove me wrong yet again  Smiley
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Skwishee
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Re: Red Cap Oranda - please advise
« Reply #7 on: June 19, 2012, 08:31:17 AM »

The thing I've learnt most, is that goldfish need a lot of space to grow and exercise. What cold water tanks have you kept in the past? Just the small 62 litre?

The guys here have pretty much hit the nail on the head. A bigger tank will be much appreciated by the fish!
For fancy goldfish, the minimum stocking is around 80 litres/20 gallons for the first fish and then count 40 litres/10 gallons for each additional fish there after. So depending on how many fish you'd like to keep, you can work out a rough tank size using the guide Smiley
I think tanks also need to be a minimum of at least 4 foot or so, to allow for exercise.

50% weekly water changes is also a good way to go along with having lots of filtration, generally 10x the tank size is advised, so for example in a 150 litre tank, you'd want around 1500 litres per hour being turned over.
If you shop around for external filters (these have loads more room for media than internals), you should be able to find a good deal Smiley
I know a company in the UK (All Ponds Solution) which sell reasonably priced filters -I currently use their 1400+ model- and I'm pretty sure the filters are available elsewhere under different names (SunSun, Eagles Aquatic, Aquatop).  Smiley
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