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Author Topic: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?  (Read 1235 times)
cdale
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Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« on: March 23, 2012, 12:54:05 PM »

Hey guys!
I have noticed that Carlos' fins have been looking a little 'frayed' is the word to use. And now there are chunks out of them?!  Huh On both fins.
I still have ammonia present despite doing every other day water changes now...
I'm not sure if it could be fin rot because it doesn't look like fungus or anything? It looks like his normal fin but with chunks out? This could be injury but I doesn't really look like it? I have taken some pictures but I'm sorry they're not too clear, he never stays still!!  Wink
I couldnt get any of his fins looking so frayed but you can see the chunk missing...
If anyone could tell me if I could do anything to help or if the water changes are affecting him? Or what it could be?
Thanks! Smiley
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cdale
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2012, 12:56:24 PM »

In fact these pictures are totally rubbish sorry! Its his pelvic fins...
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Nossie
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2012, 03:31:06 AM »

It doesn't look like it's too bad. If I were you, I'd perform a 60% water change and add beneficial bacteria Smiley
It will probably not get better until the ammonia is gone, but you can do your part by keeping it as low as possible and by supporting the cycling process!
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Skwishee
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2012, 04:30:11 AM »

Cdale just to check, your filtration is 10x the size of the tank? So your tank was 40 litres right? So it should be 400 litres per hour Smiley
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cdale
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2012, 05:30:20 AM »

Thanks Nossie, Yeah it's not too bad but I got worried when it started to fray as that is a sign or bad water quality right? I have been trying to get on top of this ammonia but it still isnt going away  Angry I am just about to do a 60% and add my bacteria Smiley Do I just keep doing my every other day water changes to keep on top of it and help his fins not to get infected?

My tank is 48L Schwishee so that would make is slightly under filtered? i was going to upgrade but this one at the moment has quite a strong current and Carlos would hate any higher  Undecided and I am moving out and getting the bigger tank in 3 months, not too long is it?!...
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Nossie
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2012, 11:36:36 AM »

I think that should work Smiley My fish actually get frayed fins sometime if I've left the water change a few days late. He will hardly get infected as long as you don't let the waste rise to dangerous levels!
Your fish will probably be okay in the tank with the filtration you have until you upgrade, rather save the money so you can get better equipment for the large tank later rather than wasting money on filters and whatnot now. Water changes will do Smiley
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cdale
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2012, 11:56:03 AM »

Yeah my thoughts exactly nossie! Smiley
Thanks for the advice! Just can't wait to get the bigger tank now!  Cheesy
I just can't seem to get rid of the ammonia. Tested it this morning and it was still quite high at 0.50 :/ Shall I just cut down on feeding and keep doing the regular water changes to keep on top of this? It's worrying me now!  Embarrassed
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Nossie
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2012, 04:02:50 AM »

Yes, depending on how much you're currently feeding, you could try only every second day or so. And I'd change 50% now when the ammonia is so high. Hopefully it'll be sorted out soon Smiley
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cdale
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #8 on: March 25, 2012, 04:50:31 AM »

Ok Thanksss!  Smiley Ill try giving it a go and see what happens...
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Skwishee
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #9 on: March 25, 2012, 05:33:54 AM »

Cdale were you able to test your tap water for ammonia yet? Smiley
One thing I have been recommended, is a water conditioner called Prime, made by Seachem. Because what this product does is convert ammonia into a safe, non toxic form which the bacteria can easily deal with.
Whereas Stress Coat claims to remove ammonia related to chloramines, I wonder at the truth of this, but as I'm nearly out of Stress Coat now, I thought I'd give Prime a go, so will let you know if it helps in anyway!

I'd agree with Nossie, for another 3 months the filtration should be okay. When you get a bigger filter for the new tank, try and get an external one, an advantage I found with mine, is that the current from the spray bar is quite strong, but I just turned the spray bar around to face the back of the tank and Lucky seemed much happier after that. Whereas with an internal filter of the same power, you wouldn't be able to do a lot to modify the current if it was strong.
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cdale
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #10 on: March 25, 2012, 07:22:01 AM »

Oh thanks, that's interesting about the water conditioner! Yeah let me know how you get on with it, I might have a look on the internet to see if they have it and how much! Smiley
I tested my tap water and the test was yellow, so no ammonia. It's just worrying now that I have had it for so long  Undecided

Yeah thanks when I get my new tank I'm going to such for a good external filter that doesn't cost too much money, if there is such thing?! Tongue Will be much better then Smiley
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cdale
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #11 on: March 25, 2012, 07:35:07 AM »

I looked around online for Prime and found some quite cheap so going to give it a go. It's worth it if it works! Smiley Thanks for the advice Schwishee! Smiley We can both try it and see what happens! I've read about it and it actually does quite a lot to the water and sounds better than any other I've had so we shall have to see what happens... Smiley
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Skwishee
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #12 on: March 25, 2012, 08:00:04 AM »

There is one place called Charterhouse Aquatics, that has prime quite cheap, but once postage is added on top, it's a similar price to Amazon (and I found one on Amazon that had free delivery)  Smiley

From my wanderings around various forums, it is the one water conditioner I've heard people mention as one of the best  Smiley Not to mention you need such small amounts for doses so it lasts longer, which I need as I've gone through 500ml of Stress Coat in 2 months Roll Eyes

But if your tap water tests at 0ppm, then at least you know it's not the test being dodgy. I know you keep on top of water changes, cleaning and filter maintenance, so I'm not sure what could be causing the ammonia  Huh Will have to have a think on that one....

As for external filters, I got mine from here - (Link is not visible to guests. Please register to view.)
Their external filters are the cheapest ones I've found that have UV capabilities, plus if you can get one when their having a sale, it's even better. I'll update the thread review I made with how I've found it so far.
 
The only other cheaper external filters I've found is the Tetratec, depending on where you buy it as prices for those vary. But I went with APS in the end because at the time it was the cheapest filter I'd found.
So by all means have a look around and see what you like and what you can afford  Smiley
From what I've gathered so far Eheim, Fluval and Tetratec are the 3 most dominant brands.

Just remember to get one that does 10x your new tank size  Cheesy Wink
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cdale
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #13 on: March 25, 2012, 02:08:50 PM »

Yeah thanks! I'll have a look around in preparation! Smiley
Thanks for the link ill check it out Smiley
Yeah I am doing every other day water changes to keep on top of the ammonia and clean the filter etc...but nothing seems to be working  Undecided Carlos' fins are looking even more frayed now!  Huh Just thinking it must be the poor water quality? Apart from that, fingers crossed he doesn't act any different just his usual active self!
I just paid 6 for the Prime water condition so not too bad  Smiley
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cdale
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #14 on: March 25, 2012, 02:36:48 PM »

I have seen some very cheap internal filters on there. I was just wondering, do you think because of my high ammonia levels at present I should go for a new one? One that would be slightly over filtered? I could sell the one I have to get some of the money back maybe. What is your opinion? Smiley I just don't want these levels harming my fish. This filter is slightly under what is needed could it be that??  Undecided

This one looks good, would this be good for a 48L? (Link is not visible to guests. Please register to view.)
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scrivens345
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #15 on: March 26, 2012, 03:31:25 AM »

Carlos will be producing more and more ammonia as he grows...the new filter looks good, and might help...I'm afraid that you're probably stuck with the frequent water changes until you can get a larger tank
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Nossie
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #16 on: March 26, 2012, 06:11:22 AM »

You don't need to clean the filter every day! Just take out a bit of water whenever. Are you cleaning the filter in tap water? Because that would be a reason why you keep getting those ammonia readings, tap water kills the beneficial bacteria in your filter.
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cdale
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #17 on: March 26, 2012, 06:54:00 AM »

No definately not! Dont worry I knew from day one not to clean anything from the tank in tap water as that destroys the bacteria, so not that Smiley
I'm not sure whether to get the filter or not to be honest, I have hardly any money but to me the welfare of him is more important but not really when I have rent to pay  Undecided Hmmm....
Yeah Scrivens it doesn't bother me doing regular water changes...
Yeah I clean the filter every day  Undecided
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Skwishee
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #18 on: March 26, 2012, 08:42:16 AM »

If you don't mind doing the water changes, then you can keep up with those, rather than getting a new filter Wink It's hard but you have to put yourself first hun, rent is more important, you'll get into more trouble not paying that, than not buying a new filter.
Plus it means you could save your money for an external filter and bigger tank Smiley

Maybe clean the internal filter a bit less, say once a week or once a month, rather than once a day?

Also if you do need anything from All Pond Solution in the near future, I found out today that they currently have a 10% discount, with the code "FACE-10"  Wink (Not sure how long it's valid for, but might be handy)
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cdale
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #19 on: March 26, 2012, 12:37:03 PM »

I meant I don't clean the filter every day but when I do the water changes every other day  Undecided Ill stop that then and do it once a week Smiley It just gets dirty pretty easily...
Ooooo thanks Schwishee, yeah that will come in handy at some point if it's still valid Smiley Ok yeah I have to put my rent first so I will just keep up with the water changes and then have more money for the next tank!  Smiley
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Nossie
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #20 on: March 27, 2012, 05:16:45 AM »

I sometimes leave my filter for two weeks before I clean it, no problems there Smiley I think the constant flushing out of the bacteria may be the reason the ammonia is still there. If you clean it too often, the bacteria won't have time to "move in" Wink
Either way, just keep doing what you're doing, and go ahead and ask if you have any questions, we'll be here! Smiley
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fantailer
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #21 on: March 27, 2012, 07:17:01 AM »

Nossie are you supposed to clean the inside because Ive only cleaned it once in the 1 year Ive had it . But I clean the outside every week.
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cdale
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #22 on: March 27, 2012, 04:18:10 PM »

Thanks a bunch Nossie!  Smiley So glad I joined, feel if there was anything wrong I am supported Smiley Thanks guys!
Yeah ok, I'll keep doing the water changes but leave the filter for like a week or two and see how it goes Smiley I was thinking that actually, the more I clean it the more bacteria I am removing so there's less to convert the ammonia...
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Nossie
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #23 on: March 28, 2012, 05:40:43 AM »

fantailer: Do you mean inside the filter? If so, yes of course Smiley Every second week is usually a good idea for an average filter, I clean my canister filter once a month or once every 4-5 weeks.
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Skwishee
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #24 on: March 28, 2012, 08:33:03 AM »

I think with filter cleaning, it can also depend on how many fish and how big they are, the tank size and the size of the filter.

For example I left my external filter for 2 months before cleaning it, purely because I have Lucky on her own in the 90 litre Smiley But now I know the bacteria should be established *by now* it will probably be once every 4 - 8 weeks.
The internal filter that's in there I clean every few weeks.

Cdale has the ammonia still remained constant?
I'm hoping to kick the ammonia in the atoms this week with my usual 3 water changes, hopefully Prime will do the trick! Mine arrived yesterday, so I picked up a 5ml syringe for dosages today Smiley
If it doesn't, then I will well and truly go crazy XD
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cdale
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #25 on: March 28, 2012, 12:40:20 PM »

Yeah I feel the same Sckwishee! My prime also arrived yesterday so I am going to use it for the first time today but it is confusing how to measure it out  Undecided
Yeah still got the same amount of ammonia present, but I'm going to cut down on the filter cleaning and still do my every other day water changes Smiley Hopefully that will crack it?!
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Skwishee
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #26 on: March 28, 2012, 02:26:34 PM »

I popped down to the chemist and brought a 5ml syringe to measure out the Prime.
You can also use pipette's, but the pipettes I've had have broken so easily when I've used it to help me get 5ml in the test tubes of the water test kit, that I wanted something more robust.
My syringe came with a bottle adapter too, and its purple! So for 99p that was a fun thing to buy this morning, although I did sound a little crazy explaining why I needed it haha "Yeah I have this water conditioner for my tank...."

Basically 5ml treats 200 litres, so that's 0.025ml of Prime per litre Smiley
So as long as you know how much water you have in the buckets at water change, just multiply it by 0.025ml.
For example my 10 litre buckets, I usually fill with 8 litres, so 0.025 x 8 = 0.2ml  Cheesy
Although because of the ammonia in my tapwater, I aim to dose at around 1.5x so it's more likely going to be 0.025 x 12 = 0.3ml

So on my little syringe, I just need to work out how far below the 0.5ml mark I need to be for it to be 0.3ml. Shouldn't be too hard if I just mark it on roughly using a ruler to help me measure Wink

So tomorrow, I am going to do a massive water change (instead of the two smaller ones) and just hope for the best really!
« Last Edit: March 28, 2012, 02:29:33 PM by Skwishee » Logged
cdale
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #27 on: March 28, 2012, 04:37:16 PM »

Yeah good luck! Smiley
I have figured it out Smiley I did a water change and added the prime so will see what the levels are tomorrow! Smiley I have a pipette, but thanks for the advice Skwishee, You sound like you've cracked it with the syringe Smiley
I tell a lie, the levels have gone down a bit, fingers crossed this is a break through?! Theyre now 0.25 now so not as bad but Ill still be on top of this one!!
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fantailer
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #28 on: March 29, 2012, 06:48:25 AM »

Okay thanks Nossie.
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Skwishee
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Re: Fin rot? Or could it be something else?
« Reply #29 on: March 30, 2012, 02:54:09 PM »

Well I did a 50% water change yesterday with prime and do not want to look at the ammonia for fear it won't have changed!!
I'm going to do another 50% change on Sunday with prime again, so hopefully that should be all of the Stress coat out of the tank, then I will consider testing.....  Grin

Let me know how yours goes!!
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