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Author Topic: Help please for Onyx!  (Read 1613 times)
Goldiegirl
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Help please for Onyx!
« on: September 02, 2011, 11:49:38 AM »

For a couple of days I've noticed my black moor Onyx has seemed a bit off. He's had trouble in taking food from my hand (which he never does) and just kind of nibbles at the end of my finger, then hides behind a plant. I tested the water like a good little fishkeeper and it was pristine (nitrite 0, nitrate .5, ammonia 0, ph around 7.5). Yesterday morning he didn't eat very much breakfast and only stayed at the bottom of the tank. While all the other fish are active and foraging for food, he just lay there and did nothing all day. Last night he refused to eat a bite, just lay on the bottom of the gravel. He wouldn't even respond to me wiggling my fingers in front of him. When he does swim, it's very slowly and wobbly and without much purpose behind it, just aimlessly wandering only to settle down on the bottom again.

Their diet consists of pre-soaked pellets, veggies, (potato, dethawed frozen peas at least once a week to prevent swim bladder, and blanched lettuce) and an occasional bite of watermelon. The fish seem to love this but don't eat it very often, as it is only in season for a few months around here...I was thinking maybe this was making him feel ill? Although none of my other fish seemed to be bothered by it - not even my tiny little Patina.

Every week I rinse out my sponge filter in old tank water as not to destroy the good bacteria and vacuum the gravel.  The only other guess I have is that last week while I was doing my weekly 50% water change I was syphoning the gravel and Onyx got sucked onto the end of the tube...I have a piece of screening ruber-banded onto the syphon end just in case something like that happens so he didn't go through the tube, but it did leave a bit of a gash on one side of his body after he got loose. Could this injury have caused this behavior?

Attatched are some pictures so you can see how he's acting not quite right. Sorry they're cruddy quality...I was in a hurry.

Well anyways, thank you for any help you may be able to offer.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2011, 12:00:07 PM by Goldiegirl » Logged
nabi
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #1 on: September 02, 2011, 04:08:30 PM »

Do you use the attachment at the end of the siphoning tube? Something like the picture below.

[image]


How big (diameter wise) is the siphoning tube? A very large tube that is 1/2 " or more in size can have a very powerful suction without the little vacuuming attachment at the end.  Using an attachment with the siphoning tube should make it a little less likely a fish can get pulled inside or stuck on end  when you're vacuuming the tank.  One way to tell how powerful the suction on the tube is when you put your finger on the end to stop the water flow, if you feel a strong snap when you completely plug the end with your finger , then the suction is probably too strong  to use without an attachment to lessen the force.

If Onyx got sucked onto the end of the tube, then there's a possibility he could be have been slightly hurt. Your water parameters and diet are fine. There's probably not much more that can be done than what you're doing by providing him with good water quality and hope he can slowly recover on his own.

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Goldiegirl
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #2 on: September 02, 2011, 06:11:35 PM »

Thank you, nabi, for your advice regarding the syphoning tube. My syphon doesn't have one, which is why I have the bit of screening at one end.  Undecided I suppose I should get one!

When I looked in the tank this afternoon he was doing far worse...literally floating on his side about the tank on the current. He had lodged himself behind a plant and was being pecked by the other fish, who knew he was not doing well. I am quarentining him right now. I inspected him under brighter light and noticed his belly is sunken in on one side..the side that got injured. His scales are pine-coning slightly as well, so I added some epsom salt (1 teaspoon per 10 gallons) and began feeding him maticulously. Under the light I could see his tail is very bloody from everyone tearing at it. His breath comes in ragged gasps, and he hardly moves at all; when he does it's almost as though he's in pain. I got him to eat a bit of food (pre-soaked pellets; he refuses anything else)...not much, but every bit helps. I am also blowing a fan on the water to help lower the temperature. I hope this will lower his intake of oxygen and slow down his heart rate a bit. He seemed to perk up a bit when I turned it on.

Doing all I can...please say a little prayer for him.  Smiley
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Ron H
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #3 on: September 02, 2011, 11:12:09 PM »

sorry to hear about Onyx Goldie, here's hoping he's only suffering a little bruising to his side and some symtoms of shock, bruising could be a reason why he is reluctant to swim about... looks like you have done all you can, maybe reducing or dimming the aquarium light could lessen his stress during recovery... all the best, thinking of Onyx > Ron

ps: I am away on a houseboat photography holiday worrying about my fish and how they are doing... cheers mate > Ron
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Nossie
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #4 on: September 03, 2011, 03:42:21 AM »

Oh my! That's terrible Sad
It seems he really got infected from that little scratch, if the side of the fish sinks in a little it means that there's some trouble going on inside. He might have gotten something really terrible from the stress... (could be bacteria, could be parasites...)
There's always the possibility that he got some internal bleeding just in case he happened to get hit a bit harder than you noticed.

The siphon attachment is very useful in more ways except being safer to the fish, I find it really useful for cleaning the gravel since it can pick some up and get rid of the debris while the rocks fall back down Smiley

I'd just keep trying with the Epsom salts, maybe feed him some medicated foods if you can?
Let's hope he'll make it... I'm keeping my fingers crossed over here!!
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Goldiegirl
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #5 on: September 03, 2011, 09:57:27 AM »

Thank you all for your help!!!  Grin Last night Onyx was doing sooooo well! He was eating tons of food (not overfeeding; don't worry) and begging for more in the tank corner. All of his lethargia seemed to have disappeared and he was back to his old self. I think the salt and the temp. drop did the trick. He looked so good I decided to put him back in the tank under careful observation. He immediately began foraging for food in the gravel alongside the others, putting my mind at ease.  Smiley

However, this morning he isn't doing well again.   Angry It seems the others were picking on him during the night...his fins are torn in several places. Bullies! So I put him back in the quarentine again. I feel terrible for stressing him out needlessly...I just thought he would recover better in with the other fish and he was doing so well! I guess I learned my lesson the hard way.

I fed him a small breakfast (he's keeping it down, thank goodness) and am keeping up with the Epsom salts. He has a thick coat of slime going on, I noticed, as well as bloody patches in the fins. I'm pretty sure he's got some internal bleeding going on from the wound.  Sad

Will investigate a syphon hose attatchnment ASAP...no more homemade rig jobs for me. I don't ever want to take that risk again.
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Nossie
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #6 on: September 04, 2011, 03:16:36 AM »

Oh, poor thing Sad
Well, everyone makes mistakes every once in a while, if you're lucky, he didn't get too badly hurt last night Smiley
I'm actually happily surprised to even hear that he recovered so well earlier! Smiley

Excess slime coat could mean a parasite infestation is going on, but of course, any infection make the fish try to protect themselves more if they feel worse. I really hope it'll work this time too! But if you suspect an internal bleeding it could be hard to deal with...
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Goldiegirl
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #7 on: September 04, 2011, 10:33:32 AM »

Thanks Nossie, so was I!  Shocked He's a tough little thing...I've had him for about 2 years, and he's made it thorugh those first few months I was a n00b.

I could hardly believe he was doing so well just hours after doing so poorly. It's amazing what pristine water and a little salt can do sometimes...

However, this morning he seems to be getting a bit of fin rot where the others had shredded his tail. Like he needs that now.  Angry Poor little dear, his dorsal fin is slashed in so many places it looks like he has a mohawk. The salt should help heal that up though...it's the bleeding I'm worried about. His side is very shrunken in, and his scales are still protruding. He looks terrible, but somehow nothing stops him from begging for more food when I come neer his tank...a good sign.

See if I can post some more pictures soon so y'all can tell me what you think.  Smiley
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Nossie
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #8 on: September 04, 2011, 01:54:36 PM »

That's great!! Smiley
But I do wonder what's wrong with the sides? It's pretty strange to me... Huh

All of a sudden my Horus got really torn tail and started looking all lethargic too... he had a wound on the side, slightly reddish but with nice white edges, so I hope he'll heal up. Put him into quarantine today and I do hope he'll perk up!! I'm having really bad luck with my fish lately... :'/
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Goldiegirl
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #9 on: September 05, 2011, 10:34:30 AM »

Oh no poor Horus!!!  Shocked But he's in good hands.  Smiley Tell me about it...for some reason every unpreventable illness, injury, or freak accident is causing rapid fish depletion.  Angry

Onyx is not doing well this morning.  Undecided I only got him to eat one pellet for dinner (they are about the size of a pepper granule) and he is so listless...just sits at the bottom of the tank and looks droopy. I think by the end of the day I will have to choose whether to put him out of his pain or not...it's been 4 days and he's only looking worse and worse. I missed the window of opportunity while he was getting better and I threw him back in the main tank.  Sad
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Nossie
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #10 on: September 05, 2011, 12:47:39 PM »

Even worse thing is that it doesn't usually show for me when they just have something small, like a fungus infection (just once, successful treatment...) or a tad torn fins or... you know it just goes straight to the protruding eyes and scales :C

Oh no... Sad But then again, it happens that the fish perk up a little sometimes and then get worse again, with the side sunken in and all it's really hard to tell how it'll go...
I think it's really unfair that you have all this bad luck with your fish! They get eaten by snakes and raccoons and... it just feels like such unnecessary accidents when you're taking such great care of them, honestly, I don't know anyone who's so experienced and cares so much for her fish as you do :/
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Goldiegirl
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #11 on: September 05, 2011, 04:52:30 PM »

Awww thanks Nossie! Karma for you for being so sweet.  Wink But I think you have far more experience than myself, plus you care about not just your own fish but everyone else's on this website. I think that's really admirable.  Smiley I guess all fish keepers have their share of bad luck every once and a while...that's how we learn, even though it's hard. The tiniest little mistakes (i.e. not noticing a patch of fungus, fin rot, or bulging eyes and scales) can quickly escalate into some huge problem. At least, by posting our stuff on the forum, maybe others can learn from those mistakes and what to look for.  Smiley

The snakes and racoons...not to mention the birds...those are the last straw, lol! I slave my life away for these darling fish, only to prepare a tasty meal for some hungry little animal...but I've re-stapled all my screens and so far everything's been going well for the outdoor setup. I did have a little chickadee trying to figure out how to get a drink, but fortunately the screen prevented that and he ended up having to go to the bird bath instead. And the snakes are not as common this time of year fortunately.  Wink
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Ron H
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #12 on: September 05, 2011, 07:54:22 PM »

both of you deserve better, you do such great work on this site, here is some karma for you both, hope it helps, fingers crossed for Horus and Onyx...
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Nossie
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #13 on: September 06, 2011, 05:10:42 AM »

That's so nice of the both of you!! Smiley It's really nice to have your support, even if you're not having the easiest time either! Thank you so much :')
Put in the second medicine dose today... I'll change out a bit of water soon and start over >> At least he's eating! But it doesn't seem to be getting any better :/ Sometimes though, all you wish for is for it not to get worse.

Goldiegirl, Hope that grid is going to work from now on! It'd be heartbreaking if something would go catch your darlings again :'c
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Goldiegirl
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #14 on: September 06, 2011, 11:40:48 AM »

Aww how kind, Ron and Nossie.  Smiley That's so true Nossie, and eating is a good sign. Hopefully Horus will pull through. *fingers crossed*

I bear sad news today....Onyx passed away yesterday afternoon. He was only getting worse and worse, and I couldn't watch him suffer anymore. His side was so shrunken in that it almost touched the other, and he was floating listlessly to one side. He saw me and gave a feeble wiggle as if to say, "I'm ok, don't worry about me, hows it going?" It broke my heart...up until the end he wouldn't give up while he had a breath left in his weak body. He always loved life....he never ever got grumpy or upset with other fish, he always was willing to put a good face on things. And he never was afraid when I put him in the plastic container. I couldn't bear to put him in the freezer myself, so my mom silently took him from me. Onyx was always "her boy" and she loved him more than any of my other fish...I knew it broke her heart to see him doing so poorly. When she set the box in the freezer, I noticed her face contort in an effort to keep back the tears. She turned away abruptuly to compose herself for a moment, then turned back to me. "He suffered long enough." We both cried, and brought up past memories of when we first got him...how she'd noticed first how he had 3 tails instead of the usual double, how he'd been with me longer than any of my others, how the whole family had gotten so attatched to him. It's amazing how his tiny little life effected so many people. He is sorely missed.

R.I.P Peace Onyx, our boy.



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Goldiegirl
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #15 on: September 06, 2011, 12:07:19 PM »

I have YET ANOTHER problem. ^0^

With Onyx is out of the tank, Crystal, my largest fish, is having a bit of an aggression problem. She was the main one to beat him up when I put him back in the tank too soon...it was only her instinct to dispose of a fish that looked unhealthy. Now she's been munching on Copper Kate, my telescope-eye. She didn't chase or attack, just constantly nip whenever she saw her. Crystal is now doing time in a floating basket...my question is, how long should I keep her there? Just 24 hours? or the rest of the week? My hope is that when I put her back in, she will be happy to get out of the basket and be with the others, and forget about trying to chomp everyone. Any suggestions?  Huh
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Nossie
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #16 on: September 06, 2011, 02:08:58 PM »

ARGH! Just perfect! D:
Well, I kept Horus separated when he was aggressive for... I think only a day, I let him out again in the night so roughly 12 hours, but I don't think more would hurt her since the water is circulating etc Smiley
You could try letting her out after the 24 hours and keeping an eye on her, checking if she's going to be mean. If so, back in the basket! Grin
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Goldiegirl
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #17 on: September 06, 2011, 07:22:06 PM »

That's a good plan. Thank you soooo much Nossie... Grin I'd just hate to have my other babies stressed out, but at the same time I didn't want her to flip (not literally - mentally) from being confined for so long. She was locked up all night last night and all day today, so maybe tomorrow I'll let her out, but I really want to break her bad habit. Have good circulation so she has pleanty of air, but not a whole lotta room to swim. She won't be in there forever though, just enough so she becomes thankful for her freedom and gets along well with others.

Lolz, when I first saw her nip at Copper Kate I shouted out, "Play nice, Crystal!"  Cheesy
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Nossie
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #18 on: September 07, 2011, 03:42:10 AM »

I do that too!! xD The pleco sometimes comes up and tries to chase away the goldfish so he can steal their pellets >> And then I go "DANNY!! D8< BE NICE TO THE GOLDIES! D8<" And he goes back to the bottom actually... xD It's pretty weird though, I don't think they understand what exactly I'm saying... D':

And Horus is only getting worse... changed out some water today and added more medicine but... his tail is breaking more and more :'/
How's Onyx doing?
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fantailer
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #19 on: September 07, 2011, 05:40:11 AM »

Oh me too. No Galaxy Jose is not a chew toy!!! Roll Eyes

Oh no! :(I hope Horus gets better! Molly is going through something exactly like that. I don't know if she was affected by my latest ich outbreak.

Goldiegirl Sorry that you know have another fishy problem on your hands.Sad
« Last Edit: September 07, 2011, 05:43:28 AM by fantailer » Logged
Goldiegirl
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #20 on: September 07, 2011, 10:14:34 AM »

Lol Nossie about the pleco! And fantailer, that's hilarious!! XD They may not understand what you're saying, but maybe the vibrations of your voice distract/scare them?

And it sounds like you skipped my last post about Onyx, Nossie...the first one in the double post... Cry

I really hope Horus gets better! It sounds like fin rot?  Huh I'm sure you're doing all you can for him though.
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fantailer
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #21 on: September 07, 2011, 03:34:12 PM »

When I said that Jose darted and Galaxy stared at me like I was crazy. Tongue
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Nossie
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #22 on: September 08, 2011, 06:54:35 AM »

Oh, I hadn't even seen that post! So sorry Cry
That's so very sad *teary eyed*. That poor little fish :'c It's so horrible to watch them suffer like that... Cry

I've been at home with my family these last days while my sister is healing up (so someone can be with her at all times!), and I got a call today from my fiance, he said that Horus had died too :'/ He looked so small and there was barely anything left of his tail... it's really horrible since he was always so big and he had the hugest butterfly tail in the tank! He was even developing headgrowth lately (pom pom oranda??). I would have loved to keep him and see what he'd turn out to be, such a special rusty-red color too :'/

I only have one goldfish left from that strange shop now, Berry, and she's fatter than ever, and her tail has developed so nicely since I brought her from those terrible, stinking tanks, so I really hope she'll live a long, good life now that all her other brothers died on me :|

Goldiegirl, let's hope we'll have better luck with our fish from now on!!
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Goldiegirl
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #23 on: September 08, 2011, 10:06:35 AM »

Thank you for your sympathy, Nossie.  Smiley Please accept mine as well for dear little Horus.  Cry How terrible! And you did all you could for him too. Sometimes when you've done all you can do the rest is up to the fish.  Kiss You never know, maybe Horus and Onyx will meet each other in the big sky-pond and become close friends.  Wink I am glad to hear Berry is still doing well, I love it when they get nice and pudgy!  Tongue

Yes, I agree!! We need to get it together for our remaining fish!  Grin

I hope your sissy is recovering well also! That sounds like an uncomfortable surgery she had.  Undecided
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Nossie
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #24 on: September 08, 2011, 10:17:35 AM »

Maybe they will Wink In any case... it feels like a strange coincidence that our fish got sick at largely the same time :'D

She is, she is Smiley It hurts a little bit though, it seems and she gets sort of restless now and then Smiley
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Goldiegirl
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #25 on: September 08, 2011, 10:21:08 AM »

I know!  Shocked Weird how that worked out...

And glad to hear about your sister! I know how it is to feel restless while recovering too...it's so hard to go from doing anything you want to being limited...is she on any pain meds?
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fantailer
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #26 on: September 08, 2011, 03:24:24 PM »

Wait Onyx and Horus didn't make it!?! Cry
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Nossie
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #27 on: September 08, 2011, 03:27:17 PM »

Yes, a maximum of three pills a day, but pretty strong ones.. there are screws in the bone, and I'm sure you know how that feels while healing? :'D She doesn't seem to be suffering that much from it though, at most she says that it's starting to hurt, but it's not limiting her activity much Smiley

fantailer: No... sadly :'/ I think I might have reacted too late in the end... it's so hard to tell when it's something that's going to get serious! At first I just did a large water change but he didn't get better so I quarantined him after that...
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fantailer
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #28 on: September 08, 2011, 03:32:19 PM »

Oh no... :'(You both did the best you could. Sad
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Ron H
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Re: Help please for Onyx!
« Reply #29 on: September 09, 2011, 01:46:46 AM »

so sorry to hear about Onyx and Horus  Cry  here's some more karma for all of you ...
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