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Author Topic: Hyper goldfish?  (Read 6311 times)
Nossie
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #30 on: September 23, 2011, 05:32:07 AM »

It's more like this, if you see the nitrates being close to 40ppm, take out roughly 60% of the water or more, depending on how fast they'll increase. If it's normal around 20 when changing the water, a nice 40-50% will do Smiley It's not that complicated and there's no reason to be too precise Wink I usually just go with how I feel honestly, if I feel like cleaning out the tank real well, I do a bit larger water change and vacuum the gravel with the pebbles and wood removed. If I don't, I take out half the water and vacuum as thoroughly as I can without removing anything Smiley

The main reason why it's easier to see the sexes on goldfish when they're older is because they're larger Smiley You can look at her from the side, does her vent protrude slightly or is she flat? (Tee hee, I started calling Lucky "her" already... xD)
The vent should also be slightly round on a female, while a male has a more oval shape to it Smiley
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Skwishee
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #31 on: September 23, 2011, 05:56:38 AM »

Ah okay I'll remember that for my weekly water changes ^_^

I ask about the genders, because with all this close observation of Lucky recently, I have noticed, a very tiny, protruding bump just before the anal fin. I'll try and get a photo once Lucky's calmed down, I'm not sure if it is what I think it is and when I go to check the fish is flashing like crazy so it's impossible to get a good look!
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Nossie
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #32 on: September 23, 2011, 12:47:52 PM »

I took a peek at that picture you posted a while ago, and.. I don't know if it's clear enough, but I'd guess it's a girl... Smiley
You'll just have to keep an eye on her and see when she'll calm down Smiley
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Skwishee
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #33 on: September 24, 2011, 05:17:13 AM »

Yeah she calmed down after a while and managed to get these snaps of her.

You can see more clearly the little bump I was referring to.

Also, also! Yesterday the nitrites finally hit 0ppm!!!!! Hooray!!! It finally turned blue and stayed blue Grin
The ammonia is still being a stubborn element and is still yellow with a slight tinge of green... grrr.... but the colour is slowly getting more and more pale. Nitrates are around 10/20ppm still, so a safe level for Lucky.
I also double checked the PH yesterday to make sure that hadn't changed and it's fine, around 7.4/7.6 so it hasn't changed at all.

I'm still doing daily water changes to help with the ammonia and tomorrow is day 7! So adding more stress zyme, I'm hoping that'll give the ammonia the kick in the bum, that in the needs!

Treated Lucky to some brocolli last night, which she's already gobbled up Cheesy She seems okay, still has an episode of flashing here and there, but I assume thats the ammonia bothering her (I was worried it was the PH hence I double checked it).

So slowly getting there Smiley

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Nossie
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #34 on: September 24, 2011, 05:25:57 AM »

Congratulations!! Smiley Now that you know how it works, cycling the bigger tank will be a piece of cake Smiley Especially because it would be safer for the fish in there if you'd decide to let her in after a week or so since the larger amount of water will dilute the waste already.

After seeing these pics, I'm pretty sure she's a girl... Smiley On common goldfish, it's also pretty easy to spot when a female will be filling up with eggs in the spawning season (spring, naturally) as the water warms up.. Smiley
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Skwishee
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #35 on: September 24, 2011, 06:02:13 AM »

 Cheesy I'm just happy the tanks almost done cycling now!

Stress zyme is the best thing by far, definitley helped things! I think I'll carry on using it Smiley Instead of the 'fish safe' which said to add in between water changes (but its crazy leaflet suggested water changes once every two weeks Roll Eyes ) But I guess I could add it in between water changes still? I don't think the tank would need it though if its cycled?
I could always just do a water change twice a week, until I can get the bigger tank here and sorted?

So after a week of running the bigger tank on a fishless cycle she'd be okay to be added in? I'm a little worried, I might do a complete fishless cycle and add her in once everythings calmed down. I'm scared after the stress she's had, something will have affected her immunity. I don't want the ammonia or nitrites bothering her, it's a miracle she survived the ammonia spike that got Star.
« Last Edit: September 24, 2011, 06:07:38 AM by Skwishee » Logged
Nossie
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #36 on: September 24, 2011, 01:08:24 PM »

In my cycled tank, I add the beneficial bacteria when I feel like it, or when I've rinsed both filters/switched some filter media Smiley

The tank won't be cycled after a week, but if you plan to cycle it 100 without fish, you need to add fish food of some kind (or a piece of shrimp) that can start decomposing to create the ammonia for the bacteria to work with. Then when you'll add your fish, the system will still be sort of "shocked" for a while and some ammonia will arise and you'll have a mini-cycle going there. It would be safer for Lucky, no question about it, but you still need to be careful, and it might take longer doing it without fish. You can just try and see how it goes! Smiley
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Skwishee
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #37 on: September 25, 2011, 06:19:17 AM »

Yeah thanks! I was thinking of adding the fish flakes and feed some imaginary fish in there!

Going to be doing my test and water change and add that stress zyme in a bit!

I'm a little concerned with Lucky, I'm not sure if I'm being paranoid here, but the area underneath her pelvic fins is a little dark? Maybe it was always like this and I just never noticed? I think I'm just worried because the poor girl is still having flashing episodes.

Time to see what the water test says..... Will update later x

[Update]

Okay, so the water parameters are okay, Nitrites are 0ppm, Nitrates are around 10/20ppm and Ammonia is still being fickle, an almost yellow with that annoying ever so slight green tint!

Going to do a water change and then add in the stress zyme =) Then it'll be a waiting game until tomorrow I feel.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2011, 07:19:55 AM by Skwishee » Logged
Nossie
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #38 on: September 25, 2011, 10:35:28 AM »

Sounds like the water quality is fine, I wouldn't do anything when it's like that Smiley
Usually some tests are open for interpretation, like the slightly green tint will probably always be there Wink

About the darker spot, does it look blackish or more of a red spot? Judging from her color, she isn't really supposed to have markings. She might have a slight ammonia burn though, but if it's being dark/blackish it means she's healing it already, much like a bruise Smiley
(However, I have a red fantail with a white spot on his pectoral fin, and a white one with a red spot on the same fin Cheesy Funny coincidence)
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Skwishee
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #39 on: September 25, 2011, 10:57:04 AM »

It's hard to get a good look at her under belly, definitley nothing red, I think it's just the light and I'm being overly worried about her XD Although I did notice just now while looking close, that theres a white string hanging from her? It certainly doesn't look like poo.... She was definitley pooping fine yesterday!
I'll give her some peas tonight as a change from the brocolli (will also help her digestion). Keep an eye on her for now.

She's still being a little erratic but much much calmer now, I've not seen her swim head first into the filter today at all!

[Quick update]

Okay so whilst trying to get a photo of this mystery white stuff, it came out and was most definitley poo.
It was like a dark coloured bit of poo with a short white thick-ish string hanging from it, which Lucky then decided to eat and spit back out XD

I found this helpful article about poop! (Link is not visible to guests. Please register to view.)

So could it just be the stress she's been under lately thats caused it?

[Quick Update 2]

And now she's poo-ing like normal.... almost as if to say 'No need to worry, look! Heres a big normal fish poo!'
« Last Edit: September 25, 2011, 11:32:00 AM by Skwishee » Logged
Nossie
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #40 on: September 25, 2011, 12:44:07 PM »

Haha! Grin

Nah, those white, string-like poos are called "casts" and are basically nothing. Goldfish will usually produce this if they're kept in a tank with sand substrate, but it will show up sometimes too, if the fish are stressed for instance Smiley It usually looks different in case there are parasites involved or something Smiley She's fine Wink
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Skwishee
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #41 on: September 25, 2011, 01:02:30 PM »

Yeah she's doing another normal poop now! I only got worried as I was watching her... then all of a sudden was like, what on earth is that?! Why is it white? As I did read white stringy poo is bad!

She is fine now, a little erratic every now and then, but pooping away, bless her little fins!

Should be okay to stop with the daily water changes now? Should I still do water changes say twice a week with it being a small tank for her?

I'm going to test the water every two days this week as well, so Monday then Wednesday etc etc, just to keep an eye on things, but I think tomorrow I'll start feeding her a bit more, so a small amount of flakes in the morning and some veg/or live food in the evening. (It should be okay for her to have veg every day?).

Might try and get a small amount of blood worms which she can have during the week as a treat Smiley I do have some blood worms in gel in a packet, but last time it was too much for her and alot of it was left in the tank and clogged up the filter Lips sealed

[Edit]

Something that's occurred to me, I haven't yet cleaned the gravel! I left it alone for the bacteria and had to add some fresh gravel last week for the air stone. So if I get a gravel cleaner this week (could be the reason behind the trace of the ammonia? Because there's stuff in the gravel?) do I clean all the gravel at once? Or just one area?

Also I have no idea what type of gravel cleaner to even get! The tank is so small, I worry that using a syphon thing, would result in too much water being taken out. I was thinking maybe getting one that cleans the gravel and puts the water back in to the tank? Or a battery operated one? I even heard about one that sucks all the dirt in to a bag and doesn't take any water out (no idea how that works!).
« Last Edit: September 26, 2011, 04:00:46 AM by Skwishee » Logged
Nossie
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #42 on: September 26, 2011, 06:01:28 AM »

In general, you should never see poo actually coming from the goldfish. If she's carrying strings of it around, it means you're giving her too much food Smiley (And considering that you mentioned the blood worms getting clogged in the filter, that's pretty possible).
Try giving her a small amount of food, but feed her 2-3 times a day instead Smiley Goldfish don't have stomachs so they need nutrition regularly (but if you're going away somewhere, she'll be fine for two weeks as long as you changed a lot of the water before going).

Gravel cleaning should be done every time you change water Smiley Invest in a gravel vacuum (looks like a bottle on a hose basically)
[image]

You clean all of it as thoroughly as you can while you empty the water out of the tank. Since the dirt and sludge is a lot lighter than the gravel, it will be sucked out of the tank while the gravel will fall back to the bottom Smiley This is needed very often for goldfish since they make such a mess! It's not surprising at all that you've had pretty high nitrogen readings in the tank if you haven't vacuumed the gravel yet Smiley
The one I showed a picture of would work just fine, and there's no such thing as "taking out too much water" as long as Lucky can still swim around without problems Wink You may even have to take out a little bit more than usual to clean the gravel properly.
That's the problem with smaller tanks, they empty so fast you can't really clean them enough (in my experience).

Taking the gravel out to clean it would just be a waste of time and effort since there are a lot easier methods Smiley You can easily find a few "how to" videos on youtube in case you're worried about how it works, but it's not rocket science! The only difference from using a normal hose is that you can clean the gravel at the same time Cheesy
Another person might be good to have around so that he/she could stop the water flow by holding the bottom end while you empty the buckets.
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Skwishee
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #43 on: September 26, 2011, 09:04:45 AM »

Well the readings are exactly the same today, so I think a gravel clean/water change might be the thing to do the trick for that pesky ammonia that is still ever so slightly a green tint.

I have only been giving her veg. once every two days for the past week (so not sure how she could be over fed?), so will give her some veg. once today and then start with 2 small feeds a day from tomorrow. The blood worm situation was a while ago and I cleaned it out of the filter and the gravel as best as I could.

Of to the aquarium shop I go for a gravel cleaner! Thanks Noss. x
« Last Edit: September 26, 2011, 09:35:03 AM by Skwishee » Logged
Goldiegirl
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #44 on: September 26, 2011, 09:23:52 PM »

Since Lucky is in a smaller tank right now you could also use a turkey baster to clean the gravel. It is smaller than a gravel cleaner and easy to maneuver in tight spaces.  Smiley

Just reading through the advice Nossie gave...she is so smart and always gives great answers so do what she says.
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Nossie
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #45 on: September 27, 2011, 02:26:40 AM »

Actually, Goldiegirl, what is a turkey baster?? xD Pictures would be awesome x'D *embarrassing* (And thank youu! Smiley)
That could be a good option of course Smiley Gravel cleaners come in different sizes but they could be a bit more expensive than this legendary turkey baster Wink
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Skwishee
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #46 on: September 27, 2011, 02:22:00 PM »

I think a turkey baster, is an american thing?

I've never really seen them here and there certainly isn't one in the kitchen!
I managed to find a mini gravel cleaner, I can't get the suction right, but my partner (who may I add is a genius) can! So he helped me clean some of the gravel yesterday and we're going to get a more thorough clean of it tomorrow (now that we know what to do without taking out loads of water XD).

There was this fancy 20 gravel cleaner the shop man showed me, it can suck dirt into a bag or through a hose XD Battery operated too, didn't really want to spend that so I got my little one for 3.99! Plus I think my dad has a gravel cleaner for his tank anyway, I certainly re call he had a hose with a hand pump in the middle.

Water parameters are fine, ammonia is even more closer to yellow now, but I think you may be right Nossie, it may always be slightly green.

Lucky's generally fine really, occasionally swims as what I think is erratic, but I'm not sure if she's just being active, or chasing her reflection in the tank glass. It's very short lived and she goes back to casually swimming or checking something out. She was erratic for quite a long period while the tank was cycling, so I'm just a little worried about her still! Perhaps she is still under stress? (Maybe I'll post a video later Smiley See what you guys think, I am beginning to think I'm a little crazy!)

I've checked her over and only thing really is sometimes, in a certain light, not all her scales seem shiny, but then in the light they do. But I remember her being like that when we first had her, so I don't think it's anything to worry about, the areas certainly don't have any white spots or unusaul things. I think it's just the way she is bless her!

I must apologise for my paranoia Grin I just want my lucky to be okay! Maybe once she's in the bigger tank, I'll stop being such a worry wart XD Thanks guys! x
« Last Edit: September 27, 2011, 05:47:24 PM by Skwishee » Logged
Goldiegirl
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #47 on: September 27, 2011, 07:53:06 PM »

Here is a photo of a turkey baster. The way it works is you squeeze the rubber part at one end to push all the air out of the tube. You put the other end into the water and release your grip on the rubber part, causing water (and gunk) to flow up the plastic tube and into the rubber.

Glad to hear lucky is doing better!

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Nossie
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #48 on: September 28, 2011, 04:23:29 AM »

Skwishee: I always get the water flow going by just plugging the hose with my thumb and taking some water into the "bottle"-part. After that I straighten the hose and keep it vertically so that all the air can go out upwards through the "bottle" Cheesy
Gravity will do the rest of the work later provided that you have a bucket below the tank to make the water flow out... Smiley

I didn't really catch the nitrite situation, is that gone too? As you know, in a cycled tank, nitrite and ammonia will be replaced by nitrate. If there's still some nitrite present in your tank, that could be what's stressing her Smiley

Goldie: I see, I see! We call them something else entirely here Smiley How big are those?
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fantailer
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #49 on: September 28, 2011, 04:37:15 AM »

Ive hadmy pleco and betta loose finnage because of a bad thing. I just don't know why but I love deformities that aren't creepy like the treeman.
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Goldiegirl
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #50 on: September 28, 2011, 07:19:11 PM »

Nossie: the basters have an average length of 11 inches. What do you call yours?  Smiley And thanks for sharing how you start the water flowing through your syphon. That sounds a bit easier than my technique...I put one end into the water and the other end lower down by the bucket, then suck (with my mouth) one end to get the water flowing. Unfortunately I end up getting a mouth full of fish water 1/2 the time when I don't pull away fast enough.  Embarrassed
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Skwishee
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #51 on: September 29, 2011, 03:31:23 AM »

Hey guys, thanks for the tips on the gravel cleaner Grin I was too tired after work yesterday, so will be doing a gravel clean today!
Swallowing fish water doesn't sound very fun though XD

Just done my water check; PH 7.4/7.6, Nitrite 0ppm (have been so since last Friday), Nitrate 30ppm, Ammonia still has that greenish tint so it could 0ppm or 0.25ppm? It's not changed all week, so I'm a bit confused about it.

I'm a little concerned about Lucky, will put up the videos I got once I figure out how to get them off the phone and on here.
You remember I mentioned she has 'blank' spots, almost like scales are missing, I know she had one or two when we had her and only on her left side, but I noticed more yesterday, and on her right side, in certain light, there seem to be white areas? Not dot's so it's definitely not ich. I managed to get a video of it, so you guys can see what I'm talking about.

Maybe its nothing, I'm not really sure. She still has a good appetite and ate all the brocolli I gave her yesterday evening, so that's always good, at least she's eating Cheesy
« Last Edit: September 29, 2011, 03:33:37 AM by Skwishee » Logged
Nossie
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #52 on: September 29, 2011, 04:18:26 AM »

Goldie: I see! Cheesy I think our things aren't the same then, with the basters being so big... but we call them something like "pipette", maybe that one's more lab-oriented though Smiley
I never tried sucking on the hose, because I never had to xD When we got our first fish, we got a little brochure with the tank saying how to maintain the tank and change the water Smiley It showed the technique I mentioned with pictures! (Thinking I should maybe scan that and slap it here as a sticky! Wink)
When I use just the hose I do basically the same, but I use the tap to fill the hose slowly with water while I plug the lower end with my thumb Smiley

Skwishee: ...it isn't! xD When I set up my external filter I tend to swallow some too having to fill it with water by sucking the upper tube that leads the water into the tank D8

Your water parameters sound perfect Smiley At most the nitrates are a tad high (40 being maximum) but that's to expect Smiley

Missing scales is something that happens all the time Smiley If that's what you see, it's nothing to worry about. The fish will sometimes bump into the ornaments/filters and drop a scale or two every once in a while. It usually won't lead to any infection as long as the tank is kept clean Smiley
But do post the videos! Better safe than sorry! Cheesy
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Skwishee
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #53 on: September 29, 2011, 05:11:18 AM »

Thanks Nossie, I too thought the nitrates were pushing it a bit, but when I do the gravel clean later and replace that water, it'll help with the nitrates I imagine.

Well the videos don't seem to have captured any of the whiteness I was talking about and it's impossible to get a photo of, because she doesn't stay still long enough. I'll put up the two videos anyway, you'll see what I mean about her behaviour with chasing her own reflection and such. Maybe even catch a glimpse of the white bits, their on her left hand side, I believe. I'm starting to wonder if it's just how that side of her is? It's only at certain angles I can see them properly, there's no uniformity to them, so not sure what it is? Maybe some of her scales are just a lighter colour?

I also apologise for momentarily flailing with the camera towards the end of one of the videos, she moved so quick I completely lost track of where she went!

I just stuck them in a private album on a random photo bucket account I made, the password (if it asks) is just- Luckythegoldfish  Wink

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« Last Edit: September 29, 2011, 06:03:23 AM by Skwishee » Logged
Nossie
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #54 on: September 30, 2011, 02:37:47 AM »

It will, that's what the weekly water changes are for in a cycled system Smiley

As long as it doesn't look fuzzy it's okay! I don't see anything strange on her in the videos so it's probably just a few scales that fell off Smiley

(Tee hee, you have almost the same air stone I do!! Grin)
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Skwishee
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #55 on: September 30, 2011, 03:46:19 AM »

Yeah, thanks Nossie, I'm beginning to feel a bit better about her now! I've checked her over, its definitely not fuzzy, I asked my partner what he thought and he commented about missing scales. Having a look now, I think his right, its quite possible that where she's 'freshly' lost scales the colour is lighter than her other scales, but not as dark as the ones that (I hope) are healing.
It's a little worrying that she's losing quite a few scales and I just saw another of those 'casts' mentioned before.
I don't know what could still be stressing her? Will do my usual water check in a minute!

I did a nice gravel clean yesterday and gave the sides of the tank a good clean with a soft sponge Smiley
I discovered that a mop bucket on a chair is my new best friend!
As the holes in the mop bit part, are perfect for sliding in the hose, so it doesn't move Cheesy And it has a big enough capacity for most of the water in the tank, so I don't have to swap buckets, hooray! Plus the chair helps because the tank is pretty high up and the hose doesn't reach to the floor properly Cheesy

Although, with air stones, do you find they create a lot of 'splash' in the tank? I keep finding pools of water around the edge of the tank. I've checked for any holes or cracks and I couldn't find anything in amongst the gravel, or see any air bubbles while I was cleaning the tank that would have indicated a hole or crack.

I'm beginning to think its the air stone, creating a lot of surface movement, so the water is jumping up through the grates on the side. What I don't understand is why the water is pooled so closely to the bottom of the tank? Theres a puddle when its the water jumping, but un-explained water around the bottom  Huh

I'm going away for the weekend camping, but I'll get my partner to keep an eye on things until I'm back Smiley
« Last Edit: September 30, 2011, 04:15:00 AM by Skwishee » Logged
Nossie
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #56 on: September 30, 2011, 04:20:23 AM »

That's a great idea!! (About the mop-bucket holes) Never occurred to me! xD I just keep bothering my family about helping me... Wink

No, my air stone is only making the surface ripple a bit, the spraybar for the external filter is a completely different story though... x'D If I take off the top glasses it tends to spray everywhere Wink
But as long as you don't see the water volume decreasing it should be fine. Lately we got worried that the community tank would be leaking, but in the end it wasn't, we still didn't figure out what caused the sudden water around it though...

Have a fun trip! Smiley
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Skwishee
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #57 on: September 30, 2011, 06:00:00 AM »

Glad you liked the mop bucket idea Grin It only occurred to me when I was looking for a big bucket around the house to do it by myself, as my partner was busy and I wanted to do the clean before Glee was on! (I'm lame I know Wink)

Yeah I've marked the water with a felt tip, so I can keep an eye on it. It might just be condensation, or water spitting through the vents (the tank I'm using is multi use for lizards as well so has annoying vents XD), I'll check it all again on Sunday when I'm back and do another gravel clean/water change as well as adding the 14th day dose of Stress Zyme  Smiley

I think then next week I'll cut down to water tests and cleans/changes, to twice a week, as the water seems to have been pretty consistent this week and I'd rather change the water mid week than add that 'fish safe', I feel a change will do more for the tank than adding some chemicals.

Water parameters are fine, the ammonia was even slightly more yellow today Smiley Nitrates are back down to 10/20ppm and Nitrites are a sexy 0ppm!

Although have to show you this, you will laugh (Link is not visible to guests. Please register to view.)
That's the 'fish safe' right? My package design is different, but check out what it says about the pamphlet that comes with it.
"A comprehensive guide to caring for your fish"  Roll Eyes I think not Mr Product....

Thanks Noss, I'm looking forward to it! It's been a while since I was last camping Grin I'm involved in Scouting, so it's just great going with all the kids Cheesy
« Last Edit: September 30, 2011, 06:07:56 AM by Skwishee » Logged
Goldiegirl
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #58 on: September 30, 2011, 07:39:35 PM »

Nossie: Would love to see a visual of how you get the syphon water flowing sometime; I obviously need advice!  Cheesy

Glad to hear Lucky is doing so well Skwishee!

My fish get missing scales occasionally after a parameter spike or illness but I've found they grow back in about 4-6 months, sometimes sooner.

My airstone gets water all over the rim of the tank if I don't keep the hood on the tank.

And have a good trip too! That sounds super fun!  Smiley
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Nossie
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Re: Hyper goldfish?
« Reply #59 on: October 02, 2011, 07:51:36 AM »

Skwishee: Sounds about right, I'm really happy for you Smiley

Goldie: Sure! I'll scan it and upload it to the forum when I'll get home then! (At my parents' place right now)
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