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Author Topic: Pearlscale Goldfish swimming upside down  (Read 2002 times)
totaqui
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Pearlscale Goldfish swimming upside down
« on: September 05, 2010, 09:29:27 PM »

Hi you guys, I may have a problem at hand which I had ignored for the past few weeks (too long). I have recently begun to see my pet pearlscale begin to swim at the top of the tank. At first I though that he was doing it to help him swim around the tank easier because of his big belly and short fins (lol), but as time went on, I realized that even when it is feeding time, he tries to turn over, but he starts to swim on a side and bounces back to the top. Some of the others in the tank like my black moor, tries to shub him at times like if they are trying themselves to get him to turn over, but he keeps floating. Can something be wrong with his swim bladder? Or could it be something else?

P.S- I checked the pH levels and they are at zero.  Grin
« Last Edit: September 05, 2010, 10:08:03 PM by totaqui » Logged
Nossie
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Re: Pearlscale Goldfish swimming upside down
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2010, 02:36:00 AM »

Umm... there's nothing like "pH levels". The pH should ideally be between 7 - 8.5 for goldfish. I'm sorry, but the pH ain't gonna help you here. You have to test the ammonia, nitrite and nitrate, because these are toxic to fish, and in higher concentrations, this is what they do to them. Nitrates tend to make fish lose control over their swim bladder and it's directly affecting the immune system of the fish, so if your tank is crowded, or you don't have any/enough live plants, this could be the problem. It also lies in the diet of the fish. I see you've got at least two fancy goldfish, so the jar of flakes isn't going to be enough for these to stay healthy. You need to feed them two kinds of staple foods, preferably pellets as they're easier to eat. You have to supplement this diet with vegetables, such as peas, lettuce and cucumber (or something else, try some different things and see what your goldfish like!) + some frozen or freeze-dried live foods. Blood worms are usually easy to feed, and well received by goldfish. If you get freeze-dried, all you have to do is open the jar and take out a pinch of worms. Nothing complicated.

So I need to know, How big is your tank, and how many fish are you keeping? What kinds of fish? How often, how much and what do you feed them? How often are you changing the water, and how much do you take out at a time?
You also have to bring some tank water to the pet shop, ask them to test for the parameters I mentioned: Ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and pH. Post numerical results because things like "nitrates are fine!" won't help your fish, or us in any way. It'd be ideal if you'd simply buy yourself a water test kit for the future. You're going to need it!
When you have the results, I believe a large water change would be needed. Change about 60% and add water conditioner to the new water. Then observe your fish. Don't feed them anything for two days, and after these days have passed, you can start giving them some peas. Frozen peas (no salt!!) that you thaw and pop out of their shells before feeding. These are working wonders on a fish with swim bladder problems due to constipation. You could also feed the blood worms once every other day.
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Andrea
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Re: Pearlscale Goldfish swimming upside down
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2010, 02:59:04 AM »

Nossie covered everything so listen to her and your fish should be ok. I'm slightly worried you said the ph is 0 as this is impossible and the ph is your last problem anyway. I don't understand why that is what everyone tests, it is important in some tropical fish but goldfish will survive in the 7-8.5 range and it probably won't go out of that range ever! Test your water correctly please and start feeding that variety of food Nossie mentioned.
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Nossie
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Re: Pearlscale Goldfish swimming upside down
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2010, 03:27:38 AM »

In fact, living organisms can only survive in pH ranging from 4 to 9. Anything lower or higher, and nothing, absolutely NOTHING can live in it. So a 0 of pH is rather nothing you want. And like Andrea said, pH really is a small problem because it rarely ever changes as long as you keep the correct amount of fish in the tank and proper filtration. Nitrogens on the other hand... increase constantly, and that's why that is what you should ALWAYS ALWAYS test as first thing!! But if your fish show symptoms of disease, it's good to include the pH, just to be able to rule that out as a possibility.
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totaqui
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Re: Pearlscale Goldfish swimming upside down
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2010, 04:01:20 PM »

Ok, sorry about the pH comment. What I really meant to say is that I have an anmmonia NH test kit and I test the water on a regular basis. I tested the water yesterday and it was at 0ppm.

I currently have a 20 gallon tank and all five of them are goldfish; a black moor, a calico fantail, an oranda, a fantail and "bubba" the pearlscale. I know the tank needs to be bigger, but I can't change it right now. I do a 25% water change on a weekly basis and a full water change every two weeks. I feed them twice a day (morning and evening), but their diet is not varied. I have some oranges that I bought for them and an unflavoured gelatin to mix the recipe posted on this site, but time is my problem cause I'm at college. Plus I have an "ammonia remover" set-up in my filtration system to help somewhat. I'm trying with them, but another problem that I have is the lack of convenient pet shops here that provides the type of service that you spoke about whereas getting the water tested. Well thats a miracle waiting to happen.

I also want to know if I can take the veggies that you mentioned, prepare them with the gelatin and feed it to them as a sample recipe?
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Andrea
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Re: Pearlscale Goldfish swimming upside down
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2010, 10:03:45 PM »

Have you also tested for nitrites and nitrates?? In a tank that small ammonia could be a problem but those two could be even bigger problems!

Could you start saving for another tank and in the mean time have some friends look after your other fish? I totally understand where you are coming from but a 20 gallon tank with 5 goldfish in it is extremely risky and deadly!

Keep up with what you are doing but I would stop doinh the full water change. You are never meant to change all the water at once and if you continue to do this every two weeks well your tank is never going to cycle and you will just have problems after problems like the one you are experiencing now which can kill your fish. Instead stick with just doing the 25% water change every week and keep a close eye on the filter. Plus buy a test kit for everything and test everything! Just because there is no ammonia doesn't mean your water is ok.

Never ever over feed these fish either, that will just add to your problems. Just feed once a day. You can feed any of the vegetables mentioned without actually adding the gelatine. My fish's favourite is peas and pears which you can just cut up and feed, as long as there is no added salt or anything.
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Nossie
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Re: Pearlscale Goldfish swimming upside down
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2010, 02:40:10 AM »

Okay, I have a few things I need to ask of you.
Test ALL the parameters, and post the results. Since you have a test kit of your own, that shouldn't be a problem. I want numerical values.
Don't bother making any home made food, it's time consuming and a pain in the butt to feed the correct amount. Buy a jar of blood worms in the pet shop. It's that easy! Feed the vegetables fresh, goldfish do like them more that way, I think Wink
Since your tank is so small, and so crowded, the problem with your fish is probably BOTH problems with water quality AND a plain diet. Fancy goldfish will get problems if they're fed flakes their whole life.

All you've got to do, is to save up for a 50 gallon. Start right now, unless you're ready to test and change a part of the water every other day. Be sure to change at least half of it, with this many fish, you need to give them as much fresh water as possible, but WITHOUT emptying the whole tank. In doing so, you're killing off the beneficial bacteria that deal with the waste in the tank. Like Andrea said.
Remember to always add water conditioner to the new water, and rinse the filter media from time to time in a bucket of "old" tank water. Alright?
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Hanna
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Re: Pearlscale Goldfish swimming upside down
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2010, 05:40:44 AM »

Nossie and Andrea covered it all, I only can emphasize the importance of following their advice.


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totaqui
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Re: Pearlscale Goldfish swimming upside down
« Reply #8 on: September 09, 2010, 05:30:16 AM »

Thanks for all your help guys.... But Bubba passed away this morning. I found him caught between one of the decorative plants, right under the filter's water fall. The water fall was beating down on him and it damaged his whole right side. When I found him, he was still living. I placed him in a smaller tank that I had and tried to rehabilitate him by giving him all the necessities like meds, but it was too late. The incident had probably happened late in the night and he would have had to be there for a few hours. I'm thinking of selling off two of my fish so to keep the 20 gallon tank, since I can't afford it right now. I'll try to follow the advise you guys gave me and take better care of the rest.
Once again. Thank you and keep up the good work.
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Hanna
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Re: Pearlscale Goldfish swimming upside down
« Reply #9 on: September 09, 2010, 01:01:47 PM »

Sorry for your loss Sad
RIP Bubba
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Nossie
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Re: Pearlscale Goldfish swimming upside down
« Reply #10 on: September 09, 2010, 01:44:37 PM »

Sorry for your loss... Good thing you'll do what's best for the rest of the fish though Smiley That way you'll avoid similar troubles in the future.
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Andrea
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Re: Pearlscale Goldfish swimming upside down
« Reply #11 on: September 09, 2010, 10:28:42 PM »

Aw sorry for your loss Sad But what you are going to do from now on sounds excellent and all your other fish will really benefit.
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Expert51
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Re: Pearlscale Goldfish swimming upside down
« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2010, 03:27:46 PM »

i feel so bad
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Nossie
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Re: Pearlscale Goldfish swimming upside down
« Reply #13 on: October 10, 2010, 03:50:49 AM »

What for? o_O
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