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Author Topic: 75 g Tank - How much Turn Over is Okay Per Hour?  (Read 879 times)
brownbear74
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75 g Tank - How much Turn Over is Okay Per Hour?
« on: November 07, 2011, 09:54:33 AM »

I just purchased a 75 g tank to transfer my 2 gold fish into.  The goldfish are getting quite bit and are both greater than 5 inches long.  We had them in a 20 gallon tank because that is what the pet store recommended and we were changing water multiple times a week.  We are excited to get the new tank up and running so they can have more room to grow and enjoy life.

I read some good reviews in the Fruval A-218 FX5 here but I am concerned that the 607 gallons per hour that it turns over would be too much for my 75 g tank (over 8x per hour).  I had am also planning on adding a HOB rated for 75-100 gallons or so.  Probably an Aquaclear because the reviews I read here have been positive on them as well.

Can you please let me know if this is over kill or if there is something else you would recommend?    We may be upgrading to a 125 g in a few years as well depending on how the fish develop.

Thank you for your help.
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Nossie
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Re: 75 g Tank - How much Turn Over is Okay Per Hour?
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2011, 03:52:01 AM »

You'll want up to 10 times the tank volume, so the Fluval would in fact be underfiltering it.
So you could try getting something that filters at least 750 gallons/hour. If you'd intend to keep smaller tropicals in this tank, you could have less filtration, but goldfish are very messy fish and create ammonia just by breathing, so you'll need a big and proper external filter for this Smiley

By the way, you could keep up to 5 common/comets/shubunkins in that tank Wink I'd love to see photos of your darlings Smiley

Dragonii on this forum is pretty much our filter guru, so he could probably help with more details on brands, media and such Smiley
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brownbear74
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Re: 75 g Tank - How much Turn Over is Okay Per Hour?
« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2011, 09:48:51 AM »

Thank you for your help Nossie!


My daughter received the Goldies (Dora and Diego) as a Christmas gift in 2009 from a Neighbor who purchased them for their pond that summer. 

I will see if I can reach out to Dragonii on a filter recommendation.

Take care!
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Dragonii
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Re: 75 g Tank - How much Turn Over is Okay Per Hour?
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2011, 10:55:57 AM »

Congratulations on the new 75 gallon, those are very nice sized tanks.

Now on to a bit about filtration, since I have been promoted to "guru" status that is. lol

The two best options are canister filters and hang on power filters, my choice for larger tanks are canisters. Main reason is that they are closed systems and it takes a lot to clog them to the point of not working. Hang on filters are always designed with a safety bypass in them so that when the media becomes clogged the water will still flow back into the tank instead on on your floor. If you do choose the hang on style, yes, Aquaclear is the best. They have been around for ages and they have done very little, if anything to change their design, and rightfully so. If it works, leave it alone. Other good option in hang ons for a large tank are the Marinelend Emperors,  but they require some simple modding to make them the best they can be. Mostly to get rid of the need to constantly buy new media. Emperors use what is called bio-wheels for their nitrifying bacterial growth. Some like them, some don't. Most don't understand them. Problem with them is that as they grow bacteria they get heavy, when they get heavy they start to turn in a jumpy, choppy manner and people think they are not working because when they first bought it they turned in a smooth, fast rotation... up side is that they work on the same theory as wet/dry sump filters. When the surface is exposed to air and water vs being completely submersed it will grow nitrifying bacteria better. So the wheel grows a higher concentration of the needed bacteria per square inch.
However, hang on filters cannot compete with canisters. Canisters use a sealed system that forces the water through the media, they are efficient, quite, effective and if properly maintained will last for years. I had an Eheim that I ran for 15 years until I gave it to friend last year, and he is still using it today.
The Fluval Fx5 is an excellent filter, but it is kind of pricey. There are cheaper options available. The rest of the Fluval canisters however are not that great. Eheim's are excellent quality, typical German engineering... but they are now made in China and you still pay that German made premium. I have used both brands as well as Hydor, Rena, Penn Plaxx, Marineland and a few that you have probably never heard of. lol
So on to what all of my experience has led me to use...
I currently do not have a goldfish tank, but I am working on a 60 gallon cube and I will tell you what I plan to use on it. I discovered this filter about a year and a half ago thanks to an aquarium club buddy. I liked what I saw so I ordered one. I was so pleased with it that I kept it and gave my 15 year old Eheim to a friend. This is what I trust on my 150 gallon African cichlid tank.
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[image]

It does 525 gph, has quick detachable hoses, huge media capacity, UV sterilizer built in, provides all forms of filtration, self priming, only uses 55 watts, surface skimmer, extremely quiet ( I have mine in my living room and I am a huge movie enthusiast so noise is not tolerated), very little to no media bypass and you just can't beat the price.
It comes with a lot of the media needed but you will still have some empty room in the canister. Fill that with these puppies that you can get at the dollar store and you will good to go.
 [image]

These have been used for years in the hobby and they work just great. They actually provide more surface area per square inch than any commercial bio media in the hobby. Just make sure to get the cheap ones that don't have the metal ring holding them together. I personally like to cut the loop and unravel  them and then stuff them in the media trays. You will need about 2-3 bags of six to finish filling the canister, depends on if you use carbon or not.
Speaking of.... some people like carbon, some don't. Choice is up to you. I personally have gotten into the habit of using it. My tanks all have a very heavy bio load and if I don't use it the water starts to turn yellowish and they start to smell like fish tanks. lol, I don't want them to smell like anything. Some will tell you that it will get expensive and that it doesn't last long enough to make a difference... I change the carbon about once a month. I buy a 14 oz carton of it for about $10 and get around three uses out of it. $10 every 3 months / $40 a year... easily doable to keep my living room from smelling like fish. lol

As Nossie said, goldfish are messy. This is due to the design of their digestive system and the fact that they need to eat more often than most other fish. Standard rule for tank filtration is 5-7 times the complete volume of the tank per hour, but in the case of goldfish we bump that up to about 10. A 75 gallon tank would therefore require 750 gph to achieve that, the Aquatop CF-500UV will give you 525 gph. This will be sufficient for a while as long as the bioload (amount/size of fish is small). You can them buy another Aquatop and add it to get 1050 gph.... which will be enough for an upgrade to a 125 gallon tank in the future. Not a perfect 1250 gph, but it will close enough.

So for what you would pay for that Fx5... just go ahead and buy two of these.

A word or two on air pumps/bubblers.... they do nothing but make noise and create mineral deposits.
Gas transfer between water and air happens at the surface. It is aided by the movement of the surface water. A smooth glassy surface equals low o2 content, choppy/rippled surface equals high o2 levels, pretty simple. In a tank that has no other filtration the bubbles will create a surface disturbance when the rise and pop, so air pumps work great for keeping a fish in a bucket during long transports... but in a tank with good filtration they are just another device to deal with. I don't like them, they can cause really bad mineral deposits and to me it just isn't worth the hassle. If you follow any of my post you will see that I will be using one in my upcoming cube build, but that is a special exception. I don't want to use it, but it is a necessary evil in order to achieve the end result that I want due to obstacles in design.
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brownbear74
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Re: 75 g Tank - How much Turn Over is Okay Per Hour?
« Reply #4 on: November 10, 2011, 07:58:31 PM »

Dragonlii-

Thank you so much for your advice.  I looked into the Truaqua and I think I will be going with your recommendation.  I really appreciate the time spend and detail from your post.  Being a novice goldfish owner this was extremely helpful to me.

Best of luck with your cube tank.
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Ron H
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Re: 75 g Tank - How much Turn Over is Okay Per Hour?
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2011, 12:10:26 AM »

Karma for you Dragonii, very informative. cheers
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walk23
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Re: 75 g Tank - How much Turn Over is Okay Per Hour?
« Reply #6 on: December 29, 2011, 01:15:20 PM »

American Aquariums sells the SunSun HW 304B which is the same as the Aqua Top with better filter media for $100. I would add a HOB like the Fluval C4 for the redundancy and its small wet dry capacity and monitor the need for water changes with respect to the N2 cycle.  Of course for pure biological filtration you can't beat the Hydro sponges, which may be an option instead of or with the HOB. 
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cheri_alexander
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Re: 75 g Tank - How much Turn Over is Okay Per Hour?
« Reply #7 on: December 29, 2011, 07:53:24 PM »

Dragonii- thanks for the great advice (karma). I was wondering why canisters are considered better because I love my new Aquaclear, it's much easier(in my opinion) then my new Magnum 350. I too will look into the Aquatop.
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Nossie
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Re: 75 g Tank - How much Turn Over is Okay Per Hour?
« Reply #8 on: December 30, 2011, 06:35:22 AM »

Canisters are better for larger tanks because it has a huge capacity for biological filter media Smiley This is the kind of filtration all fish, and ESPECIALLY goldfish need, so it's really the best bet.
They also are far more powerful than a hang-on or internal powerfilter thanks to their size.
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Dragonii
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Re: 75 g Tank - How much Turn Over is Okay Per Hour?
« Reply #9 on: January 23, 2012, 01:20:59 AM »

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Dragonii- thanks for the great advice (karma). I was wondering why canisters are considered better because I love my new Aquaclear, it's much easier(in my opinion) then my new Magnum 350. I too will look into the Aquatop.


Yep, SunSun is the dirrect from China model. They also sell them under the names Eagle Aquatics and All Pond Sollutions as well as a few others. You can usually find them on Ebay for about $15-20 cheaper. I usually recomend Amazon because if they have any issues Amazon will stand behind them.

Another cheap canister filter option is the Odyssea CFS 500 and 700. I don't like them as much as the SuSun/Aquatop but if the budget is tight and you are creative they can be good filters.

But something that you may want to know....
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« Last Edit: January 23, 2012, 01:26:26 AM by Dragonii » Logged
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