Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
November 27, 2014, 04:30:59 AM
Home Search Search Login Register

+  Pet Goldfish - Aquarium Forum Community
|-+  Aquarium
| |-+  Health and Illness
| | |-+  Velvet - Please Help my daughter's fish
« previous next »
Pages: 1 [2] 3
Author Topic: Velvet - Please Help my daughter's fish  (Read 2107 times)
Mindemae
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 256
Posts: 2458



Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #30 on: October 24, 2010, 11:03:34 PM »

OMG don't unplug the filter!  You need it running or your whole eco system will shut down!
You need alot of water agitation because warmer water has less disolved oxygen levels in it.
If you want to quit the salt treatment then that is up to you.  Treat however you feel most comfortable.
I don't think captain is going to make it. Sad  He was too unhealthy to begin with.  You could just take the other fish back to petsmart and tell them to treat him that it is too stressful.  If you are picking feeder fish, then they are all unheathy.  They are disease ridden and culls.  They are food for other aquatic animals like turtles.  I've bought feeder fish from petsmart but have always had to treat them with oral antibiotics and water treatments.
Logged
Summer Time
Full Member
***

Karma: 43
Posts: 432


Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #31 on: October 24, 2010, 11:33:35 PM »

I plugged it back in. Thanks again.  They are not feeder fish, they are the well bred goldfish.
Logged
pappy-fish81
Full Member
***

Karma: 82
Posts: 413


Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #32 on: October 25, 2010, 12:05:57 AM »

I use sponge filter for my hospital tank so that way the sick fish won't get stuck to the filter/ filter strainer.  I use the one that's been in my cycled tank. Sponge filters will not remove medications. Smiley
Logged
pappy-fish81
Full Member
***

Karma: 82
Posts: 413


Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #33 on: October 25, 2010, 12:10:56 AM »

Here are links about Sponge filter:

(Link is not visible to guests. Please register to view.)

(Link is not visible to guests. Please register to view.)
Logged
Nossie
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 481
Posts: 5469



Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #34 on: October 25, 2010, 03:35:40 AM »

Minde: I've been reading mine all the time! It's wonderful and has really helped me understand the osmosis and digestive system of fish Wink The pictures were pretty disgusting at first though! xD Those gill worms and internal worms were horrible xD

Summer time: I'm so sorry that it's so hard for you Sad But sometimes one can't save a fish no matter how hard you try simply because the disease has gotten too far before the fish started showing symptoms! I've told you all many times how it was with my oranda once (the golden one) I was noticing symptom after symptom on him and in the end it was nothing I could do for him because his belly was deformed and RED. Meaning that he was already eaten from within by bacteria.
Either way, you should absolutely continue treating with salt if you want to get rid of this parasite! And you remember, if it looks like velvet, keeping the tank dark would help too Smiley At least you could save the new fish! If you're worried about captain getting stuck in the filter, you could try to somehow cover it with something temporarily, like a pot or some bigger ornament on the bottom an inch or so from the intake. I'm sure you'll manage this time as you caught it so early! Smiley
Logged
Summer Time
Full Member
***

Karma: 43
Posts: 432


Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #35 on: October 25, 2010, 06:49:54 PM »

Thanks for all your help!  Nossie, you're my favorite!  Smiley    Also Pappyfish81 and Hanna are both excellent sources of information and personality, along with Andrea.

A big ego does not belong on a forum such as this, it causes problems, and minimizes discussions.

I have had goldfish flourish under my care for over 5 years, with not one becoming sick, and never having had to medicate them.  I am currently having a hard time getting some new additional fish to add to what I have, but I will achieve it.  

I am no longer going to experiment with salt and all the other guessing that some people have been sending my way.  I'd rather use conventional medication and just fix the disease right away, using common sense, rather than watch them slowly die, while someone else takes notes on my experiences.



Logged
Mindemae
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 256
Posts: 2458



Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #36 on: October 25, 2010, 07:17:13 PM »

How do I have a big ego?
I just treated two tanks with progressive salt treatment and it worked for me.
You asked for help and I gave it to you.  I also told you that you did NOT have to do the salt treatment if you didn't feel comfortable with it.  I also gave you links for information on treating velvet and other diseases.
I have had goldfish and some tropicals for most of my life.  
The reason I said to take the fish in to petsmart is that I know they treat their fish with quick cure and maybe they would treat it for yousince you bought the fish there. 
I'm very sorry if your fish died.  I didn't give you any suggestions for treatment that I wouldn't do to my fish myself.
Logged
Nossie
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 481
Posts: 5469



Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #37 on: October 26, 2010, 03:04:43 AM »

It su cks that the first disease you had to deal with was something as hard as Velvet Sad I found a few other useful treatments against these parasites, but both will stress your fish very much and may even kill them, so I don't think it'd be advisable to use the pure compounds to treat, since you aren't very experienced (I wouldn't use them myself either) but some medication with these as ingredients. Look for something with Copper or Formalin, these two should have strongest effect on the parasites.
To be honest, I'm really confused about this disease, because in one book it says that salt won't work, and in the second it says that salt and raised temperature should do the trick. Luckily though, you can usually combine salt with other meds, but be sure to read on the label first if that's alright with the particular one you'll use!

Although, there are some things that salt should always be used for, like ich, or when quarantining fish. Using anti-bacterial -fungal or -parasitic medication during quarantine or when there are only slight signs of disease would be very stressful, and it would contribute to more resistant pathogens Undecided But I guess you can figure out yourself when it's time to use this or that medication anyway Smiley

How are the fish by the way? Are they getting any better?

There are big egos on the forum, but none of them tried to help you Wink Luckily for you! Only the more experienced and helpful people wanted to share their opinions and advice Smiley And Mindemae is definitely one of the most experienced in the bunch! Her advice have helped me very much through the last year of fish-keeping. So please don't disregard what she has to say.
Logged
Andrea
Sr. Member
****

Karma: 163
Posts: 1059



Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #38 on: October 26, 2010, 04:17:36 AM »

I feel very sorry for you Summer time such a horrible thing to go through which many people on this forum wouldn't be able to deal with (me Tongue). But maybe favouritism doesn't belong on this forum either  Undecided Everyone tried to help you and that is what we are all here for, especially Mindemae who knows an extreme amount!

Unfortunately you don't know the real health of a goldfish when you get it, nor it's background or what is has been through. We can try as hard as possible not to buy a sick fish but sometimes it happens. I've been through this lately, with alot of struggles with a fish that seemed perfect in the shop. I don't believe she is sick, but maybe not as strong as she looked.

Let us know how your other fish are going Smiley
Logged
Hanna
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 257
Posts: 3108


Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #39 on: October 26, 2010, 05:38:28 AM »

GEE summertime this is a hard thing to go through, I would continue tratment and not stop it, as I think it won't get better dtopping it but there is a chance that it will if you continue.
I wish I could help more but I am not familiar with treatments, only could advise what is written in books anyway. I'll find a link for you and will post soon, hope there is more info for you.

SORRY I cannot help more  Sad
Logged
Hanna
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 257
Posts: 3108


Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #40 on: October 26, 2010, 05:44:44 AM »

(Link is not visible to guests. Please register to view.)

Here it is, hope you can find the info you need asap and save Captain.
Nossie and Mindemae kept goldfish much longer than I have, I believe and they both are an encyclopedia on legs, So I'd really follow their advice.

I keep fingers crossed for you
Logged
Mindemae
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 256
Posts: 2458



Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #41 on: October 26, 2010, 08:50:58 AM »

Thanks guyz! Smiley
With fish keeping, not one person can know everything and it is an ongoing learning experience the longer you keep fish.  You will learn new things all the time.
Like with my bout with ich recently.  I learned that you don't just rinse off the plants but actually should incubate them. I never knew that and never had before! I felt really d*mb that I put my fish at risk for their health and maybe even their lives. Sad  I panicked and looked for encouragement and advise here.  I hadn't seen a fish with ich for 6-7 years.  When you don't have sick fish for a long while you have to try to remember how to treat and decide what is the best course of treatment for your fish but for you as well.  I was worried I would lose a fish or two.  I was heartsick to say the least.  I feel very bad that Summertimes fish didn't respond to treatment. Cry  Summetime I wish you all the best that you will find healthy fish and will never have to go through something so heartbreaking as this again.  But that isn't reality either.  Pets get sick and even die and sometimes we never know why or even what might have made them sick in the first place. Sad
Logged
pappy-fish81
Full Member
***

Karma: 82
Posts: 413


Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #42 on: October 26, 2010, 09:19:50 AM »

Summertime: What Mindemae said is very true and we just have to deal with the situation and hope for the best. I lost some of my favorite fish too. It made me very sad because you get attach to them. I understand how you feel. Smiley
Logged
Summer Time
Full Member
***

Karma: 43
Posts: 432


Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #43 on: October 26, 2010, 10:49:37 AM »

Hi. I agree that you are all very knowledgable and I have learned a lot from each of you. I'll send an update tonight, too hard to type on this little phone. Still struggling tho.
Logged
Nossie
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 481
Posts: 5469



Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #44 on: October 26, 2010, 12:44:23 PM »

Hope to hear more from you about your fish soon! Feel like I haven't seen any more detailed reports for a while now Smiley
Logged
Hanna
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 257
Posts: 3108


Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #45 on: October 26, 2010, 05:39:39 PM »

Yes, please keep us updated !
Logged
Summer Time
Full Member
***

Karma: 43
Posts: 432


Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #46 on: October 26, 2010, 07:43:21 PM »

Hi.  I'm glad you are all still giving me advice, even Mindemae.  Smiley

Captain died yesterday morning.  I guess he may have been to weak to treat, but I still don't like that answer.

The white fish (we've named him Flash) was fine yesterday morning, then 11 hours later, he had gone downhill really quickly.  Dorsal fin down all the time and not swimming much.  He also looked kind of yellowy, when he's normally bright white.

So last night I gave up on the salt treatment.  It definitely was NOT doing anything toward this Velvet.  Like Nossie, I too have read that salt will work on this, and that it will not work on this.  I'm convinced that it has no effect on Velvet.

Last night I put in Maracide (which treats Ich, Velvet, and other external parasites).  Then I did a 20% water change because I was uncomfortable with so much salt in the tank (even tho it may have been fine).  I realize I should have done the 20% water change before adding medicine.  Fed him freeze dried blood worms for protein (something I learned from all of you), and crisps.

Flash is much better today, dorsal fin up and swims actively.  The tank is in a room that's not bright, and it's been dark and rainy outside so that helps.


What I have learned from this is that since one fish was weaker and one strong, I would have treated them in separate tanks, using salt (unless it's Velvet, because salt doesn't treat Velvet), anti-parasite food, and heat on the weaker fish, and Maracide (for the parasites) along with Maracyn (to prevent any secondary infections) on the stronger fish.

The main idea is that the weaker fish will probably not survive the strong effects of some medications, so you would want to treat them with something that is easier on their system yet still kills the parasites/bacteria.

Sorry I'm so detailed, I'm like that naturally, will try to post shorter next time Smiley

I just want a house with 2-4 goldfish.  Not hundreds, and no hospital tanks all over the place, not yet anyway.  Smiley  Just some pets  Smiley
« Last Edit: October 27, 2010, 10:41:59 PM by Summer Time » Logged
Hanna
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 257
Posts: 3108


Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #47 on: October 27, 2010, 03:49:17 AM »

 Cry I am so sorry to hear about Captain, RIP little brave fish  Sad
Logged
Andrea
Sr. Member
****

Karma: 163
Posts: 1059



Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #48 on: October 27, 2010, 03:59:19 AM »

Oh I'm so sorry to hear about that  Sad It makes me really worried about where you got them from. I personally wouldn't want to go there again. Or and I'm sure you've said this (sorry!) but has flash been kept in the same tank as these two other fish? He sounds like a strong fish but I'm scared this disease is still alive so maybe keep up with the medicine just in case and the salt? I dunno, I really no nothing about vevelt Sad
Logged
Nossie
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 481
Posts: 5469



Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #49 on: October 27, 2010, 04:14:18 AM »

It's good that you're detailed! That way we'll know more about the problem Smiley
However, I reacted pretty strongly to the fact that you said that you changed water AFTER adding medication. Did you dose the new water with it as well? It's very important that you use the medications exactly according to the manufacturer's instructions.

Weaker fish usually can't handle strong medications, but unfortunately for them, by the time the fish has been weakened, a strong medication may be the only thing to successfully kill the parasite/infection. So in the end, Captain may not have had a very good chance to survive anyway :-/ I'm very sorry for that though Sad

Well, please post once in a while with info how it's going with Flash! Smiley
Logged
Summer Time
Full Member
***

Karma: 43
Posts: 432


Re: Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #50 on: October 27, 2010, 10:44:42 PM »

Still going strong  Smiley

I made a change to my earlier recommendation, which most of you probably already know this by heart, but for any newbies:

(Link is not visible to guests. Please register to view.)

What I have learned from this is that since one fish was weaker and one strong, I would have treated them in separate tanks, using salt (unless it's Velvet, because salt doesn't treat Velvet), anti-parasite food, and heat on the weaker fish, and Maracide (for the parasites) along with Maracyn (to prevent any secondary infections) on the stronger fish.

The main idea is that the weaker fish will probably not survive the strong effects of some medications, so you would want to treat them with something that is easier on their system yet still kills the parasites/bacteria.

Logged
Summer Time
Full Member
***

Karma: 43
Posts: 432


Re: Velvet - Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #51 on: November 07, 2010, 10:20:19 AM »

He has recovered nicely, and is strong again.  Smiley

The medication messed up the biological filter a little.  There was a slight ammonia reading, which I have corrected with water changes and adding Stability.  It is looking like a normal cycled tank again.

I wonder if I should have also been using Ammo Lock during the treatment period?  Or adding Stability sooner?
Logged
pappy-fish81
Full Member
***

Karma: 82
Posts: 413


Re: Velvet - Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #52 on: November 07, 2010, 02:54:34 PM »

When I had to treat a sick fish I always put Stability in the hospital tank. It says on the label to also use it when your medicating. So I did!  Smiley
« Last Edit: November 07, 2010, 02:59:03 PM by pappy-fish81 » Logged
Summer Time
Full Member
***

Karma: 43
Posts: 432


Re: Velvet - Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #53 on: November 07, 2010, 03:26:29 PM »

Next time I'll know.  Thank you!
Logged
April
Sr. Member
****

Karma: 133
Posts: 819


Re: Velvet - Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #54 on: November 07, 2010, 03:39:55 PM »

Hi Summertime, I've used Ammo Lock because ammonia levels were dangerously high when I was cycling my little 10gallon tank and I am still getting false readings in ammonia levels a month later. Even with multiple big water changes I haven't been able to get the reading to drop. I changed the filter media in my power filter (not the biofilter part) recently and that has helped. I recently discovered thru the help of a friend of Hanna's, that my tap water is the culprit because it has high levels of hydrated lime in it. This is confusing my ammonia readings - so frustrating. Wish I lived near a natural spring to get my water there. Sorry for the rambling my point is that I most likely didn't need to use ammo lock. I would not use that product again personally as I also learned that one of the key ingredients is formaldehyde, and I'm afraid that it could be toxic to my fish. The product Stability looks to be the one I need to get as I have begun to cycle a new larger tank for my little aquatic friend. Also some Prime and Purigen if I can get them here in Canada. I wish you the very best with your fishies Smiley
Logged
Hanna
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 257
Posts: 3108


Re: Velvet - Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #55 on: November 07, 2010, 04:43:50 PM »

April, you should be able to get them there too, Stability, Prime and Purigen are all SEACHEM products.
Logged
pappy-fish81
Full Member
***

Karma: 82
Posts: 413


Re: Velvet - Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #56 on: November 08, 2010, 04:00:35 AM »

@Summertime: Your welcome  Smiley
Logged
Nossie
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 481
Posts: 5469



Re: Velvet - Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #57 on: November 08, 2010, 05:02:41 AM »

Good to hear that your fish has recovered Smiley

Personally, I'd stay away from any products that will interfere with the test readings, or in any way change things that can be repaired through some medium water changes. So if I was you, I wouldn't even buy a product like ammo lock.
Logged
Hanna
Hero Member
*****

Karma: 257
Posts: 3108


Re: Velvet - Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #58 on: November 08, 2010, 06:28:08 AM »

Summertime, we must celebrate your darling fishies recovery! Grin
Logged
Summer Time
Full Member
***

Karma: 43
Posts: 432


Re: Velvet - Please Help my daughter's fish
« Reply #59 on: November 11, 2010, 08:24:28 PM »

Thanks!  Yes, we need to celebrate!   Grin

I am so relieved and happy that he's doing so well.  He is SO CUTE.  I'm going to wait a month or so, then put him in the tank with my shubunkin.

He has had black marks on the tips of his fins and tail since the medication treatment ended.  The ammonia did go up a LITTLE during treatment, but not high at all.  He is very active and happy and seems very strong.  I don't know if the black is from ammonia, or if it's marks from the Velvet and medicine.

I wish these marks would go away, which I have read could take a month.


Logged
Pages: 1 [2] 3  
« previous next »
Jump to:  
Page created in 0.559 seconds with 16 queries.